User talk:Fox007/Build:Team - UW Wall Group
Ditch dolyak on the warriors, armor doesn't stack and you already have armor of earth. Also, whats with 3 tanks? You really only need one. Lord Belar 17:21, 12 October 2007 (CEST) :The Warrior's Don't take Dolyak Signet for the Armor but for the anti-knockdown given by it usefull against Terrorweb Dryders. 3 tanks are used to create a wall of tanks completly blocking the way to the Caster's making it a save UW Build.Fox007 17:26, 12 October 2007 (CEST) ::You say to bring ward of stability in there, you don't need dolyak for anti KD. You most defientaly do not need three tanks to do UW, it can be done easily with only one. Lord Belar 17:31, 12 October 2007 (CEST) :::You got a point for the Ward but i made this build to make UW alot easier to complete this is the most safesiest build and Btw the only UW team that completes UW on PvX (unless i missed one) Fox007 17:37, 12 October 2007 (CEST) ::::I'm not saying this is a bad build, I was just pointing out that it would be more efficient with fewer tanks. Lord Belar 17:38, 12 October 2007 (CEST) :::::Taking fewer tanks could be possible but i just like The walls. it makes the it much more safe for the caster' s or even if you got a good wall you got less problems shattering enemy's when they surround the foe completly. Fox007 17:45, 12 October 2007 (CEST) These tanks... I dont know. Why don't you get 3 earth elementalist tank? They're much stronger (almost all of the tank's skills are earth skills - +4 in an attribute is always good), their obsidian flesh last longer (have more damage reduction and more armor from spells), and do not need BiP so often. They are bonded, so i doubt they can get any damage. And they can equip visage spells that makes an UW run much easier. By the way i agree with Belar - the Wall strategy in the Underworld isn't the best. Voidwalker 21:20, 14 October 2007 (CEST) Excessive defense and low damage. This might help with HM Underworld, (never been there) but normal mode is easily clearable with a balanced group of decent players running builds that might actually deal damage. Teutonic 21:24, 14 November 2007 (CET) :Answer for Voidwalker: Taking a Earth Ele Instead of a Obsidian war ain't very good idea since the Armor stacking has been nerfed and a warrior Got much more Armor then a Ele. And a Warrior can use all the spells to kill the target enemy if they got enough energy. (Radiant Attutment rune Armor + Totem Axe + a Offhand which gives you + atleast 2 energy. will bring up to 43 Energy or above and 45 Energy is used to activate all spells Energy Regenaration of the warrior itself makes them to get the last 2 energy with in the casting times of the other spells.) Yes, i do just made this up and made the Bip Useless which means there will be room for a third Ele. And maybe i can you can take 2 Tanks instead of 3 which makes it able to create 4 ele's. Answered Teutonic i hope^^.--Fox007 15:15, 17 November 2007 (CET) From my experience, it is not possible to keep OF up constantly using a warrior. I do on my warrior, but I take consumables and elemental lord to get my Earth attribute up to 14. On hard mode, you need earth at 15 to have permanent OF coverage with glyph of swiftness to get past the nasty mesmers on the Four Horseman quest. They have 1/8 second cast time spells that -just- manage to sneak in and interrupt something important. I would have one tank be a warrior and one be an ele to balance out. Anti kd is nice in some spots and easily obtainable perma OF is nice in others (specifically Four Horseman). Markh 19:12, 4 December 2007 (CET) :You are indeed Right it is impossible to keep on OF constant without consumables but with a 20% longer enchantment wep and Glyph of Swiftness you will be 1 second without OF. And you should use Glyph of concentration instead of Glyph of Swiftness at the 5 horseman Quest. Since Glyph is a Glyph and not a spell it can't be interrupted by any of the Horsemans skills. --Fox007 16:50, 5 December 2007 (CET) ::Without permanent OF, you could be targeted with Power Block while casting. As i understand it, the disabling effect still occurs even if using Glyph of Concentration, which is potentially fatal given most of your skills are on one attribute. Gekomac 05:18, 26 December 2007 (EST) :::missed that skill and the only solution for it is using Earth ele's instead of warrior's. --Fox007 07:13, 26 December 2007 (EST) Why not just go in solo with an assassin or ele or dual with 600/smite or something. There are better ways to do it with every profession so nobody gets left out of the ecto goods. @v 04:49, 11 December 2007 (CET) :this is not for ecto farm it is for UW HoM Statue --Fox007 17:38, 11 December 2007 (CET) Similar Builds In recent edits this is becoming increasingly like the build i have in trial. Rather than have the two builds, it makes more sense for me to instead help out with this one. Mainly, they differ in the number of tanks, the style of tank (less so now you have changed to an elementalist build) and the monk backline. All of these could be placed as variants. An E/D Tank gives more self healing, and is probably more effective vs foes like aatxe, whereas the E/Me versions i use are better on the plains. Obviously both have their strengths, and could all be placed as variants. A third option would be an E/Me using Stonestriker and Mantra of Earth. One thing i have to say about the E/D build is that Armor of Sanctity seems fairly pointless. The only foes who deal enough damage for it to be helpful are aatxe, and the damage they deal through Armor of Earth, Stoneflesh Aura, and Life Bond is fairly small (even smaller if you brought life barrier too.) All other foes do small enough damage that Armor of Earth + Stoneflesh Aura + Bonds will reduce it to 0. Armor of Sanctity is therefore pretty much anti-aatxe only. It also seems fairly useless if you are relying on burning from the eles to trigger it. If the eles are close enough to nuke, then the monks are close enough to heal the minor damage that the tank would be receiving. The number of tanks is a matter of preference. Obviously, some people are going to prefer the security of three tanks, while others will feel this is excessive and prefer an additional damaging character for speed. I suggest putting a variant to leave the third tank out in favor of a secondary damaging character like an SS Necro, or even just an extra SF nuker. Another variant is for the nukers to go /mo for a hard res instead of /me for arcane echo. This decreases damage output, but adds security against wipes. Disasters happen, especially in PUGs. The monk backline depends on whether you prefer ease of healing while things are going well, or effective healing when they are not. A healing monk using LoD is able to easily heal their tanks from a distance, but is much less effective at protecting the rest of the party if agro breaks on the rest of the party. A WoH Monk might have to run in to heal their tanks, but is much better at keeping the party alive with a couple of aatxe rampaging through them. The same applies to the bonder. Taking Life Barrier as an elite will completely reduce almost all damage, making it even easier for the LoD monk. However, if the rest of the party, or the bonder itself, falls under attack, the bonder is completely useless unless they are very good at microing their bonds, dropping those that aren't needed and throwing up new ones on people under attack, something that i frankly, haven't seen very many people do. Taking Blessed Light meanwhile, means that the Tanks will take a little more damage from hard-hitting sources, but is able to support the main healing monk when things go wrong. It packs a very effective hex removal skill, great against bad Mindblade spawns, and has condition removal, which allows the main monk to go without in favor of something more useful. Gekomac 10:08, 27 December 2007 (EST) BTW, my build is here, for comparison Build:Team_-_Balanced_Underworld Gekomac 10:11, 27 December 2007 (EST) :The builds do have very much in comment and i think the only difference is preference. And we should indeed create one build together. :First of all i don't think this should be a team build but more a huge advise for builds to use in the underworld :Most people prefer just 1 tank to have much more fire power and think that 3 tanks is to much like you said. :Some people think that the E/D is better then the E/Me since E/D got energy regeneration while others think that the E/Me is better then the E/D because of the better energy manegment. So i think we should post both builds with there variant's and needed armor so people can choose just as they prefer. :The SF ele's are exactly the same using /Me for more firepower while trusting on your tanks not to fail. /Mo for a Hard rez if you do not trust the tanks or because you think there might come some unpredicted situations. :The SS Necro is also as people prefer he can manege some energy for the bonder out of battle and do some damage in battle. while some think a ele with Meteor Shower and a SS necro together just doesn't work as well as just another ele instead of the necro. :The monks have always been such as people prefer them some do prefer party wide healing while other's prefer Target player healing and some prefer a combination of them. I think the best build is for this team to have a combination of WoH and Heal Party to easy heal the tanks with there low damage without getting to close on them and WoH to heal if there are foes how break the wall and attack the caster's behind the wall. :I totally agree what you have said about the bonder. I have had alot of comments that Life Barrier + Life Bond is just to much just for a few Aatxe. And so i have chanced this to Blessed Light. :Ofcourse aren't these all variants how excist but it are the most used and i think, like i said in the beginning, that we should add the most commen used variants and add them on the same page. Fox007 14:11, 27 December 2007 (EST) Another matter of survival, both monks have no protection skills except for the bonds. If an aatxe trains on a squishy, there is no way the monks will be able to keep them alive. Prot Spirit at the least is needed. I added this as the optional skill on the Bonder, but it really should be carried on the Healer as well. The stats are already split as a hybrid, but i wasn't sure which skill to drop it in favor of. Healing touch is one option, although this leaves the monk relying on Ethereal Light and LoD for self heals. Dismiss condition could be dropped, but this leaves the party without condition removal unless the bonder is using Blessed Light. Really, i think the best choice to go is Recall. While it seems useful as a means of taking a quest and then quickly getting back to the party, there aren't many situations where you can't just walk back instead. After all, taking 10 seconds to walk to the party, or instantaneously teleporting to the party, but being unable to do anything for 10 seconds, in the end amounts to the same thing.Gekomac 00:41, 29 December 2007 (EST) Ward of Weakness + Armor of Sanctity + Something like Aftershock = Gud. Rickyvantof 14:35, 24 January 2008 (EST) Build needs an update LoD doesn't need Holy Haste. Seed of Life should be on both Monks. etc.--Relyk 14:41, 12 March 2008 (EDT) :Eth light does. — [[User:Rapta|'Rapta']] 19px (talk| ) 14:44, 12 March 2008 (EDT) Just do ursan Just do ursan cuz its so much easier and this is pretty impractical, im sure it will work but its not like you couldnt use a different build and make it a ton easier.Extreme 11:56, 13 March 2008 (EDT) tru ursanway is faster /better and has more room for error than this ::Maybe ursanway is for noobs who suck at the game, and can't do elite areas without insanely overpowered skills, and some of us refuse to run ursanway? Gosu Death :::Or for people who like to do things quick and easy so they have more time to spend with people in real life. You know, that place with sunshine and fresh air? The place the pizza guy comes from? - [[User:Panic|'PANIC!']] [[User Talk:Panic|'pewpewpew!']] 14:25, 13 March 2008 (EDT) ::::The term 'real life' is really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really stupid. [[User:Railin|'Railin']] 14:30, 13 March 2008 (EDT) :::::Because you consider your interaction with Guild Wars to be 'real'? - [[User:Panic|'PANIC!']] [[User Talk:Panic|'pewpewpew!']] 14:33, 13 March 2008 (EDT) ::::::Or LIFE for that matter?! - [[User:Panic|'PANIC!']] [[User Talk:Panic|'pewpewpew!']] 14:33, 13 March 2008 (EDT) :::::::I consider talking to people is real. Talking to you is real too. Communicating over the internet is real. Playing chess with someone in the same room is real, and playing guild wars with someone over the internet is real, you just don't see the friend you're playing with in person. [[User:Railin|'Railin']] 15:10, 13 March 2008 (EDT) ::::::::If that's what you consider the definition of real to be, then I can see why you might find the term unsavory. - [[User:Panic|'PANIC!']] [[User Talk:Panic|'pewpewpew!']] 15:21, 13 March 2008 (EDT) :::::::::There are people how prefers doing something better then pressing 1 & 2. --Fox007 15:32, 13 March 2008 (EDT) ::::::::::And some people prefer to just get their farming done with as quick as possible. It's a trade off between speed/simplicity and entertainment. No reason to insult everyone to runs Ursanway because you prefer to use something else. - [[User:Panic|'PANIC!']] [[User Talk:Panic|'pewpewpew!']] 15:39, 13 March 2008 (EDT) UW really isn't that hard to beat with a decent team. You don't even need a tank. [[User:Railin|'Railin']] 14:15, 13 March 2008 (EDT) :/agreed, btw ursan is for fags only. Frans 14:31, 13 March 2008 (EDT) ::Why, cause it works?--71.67.243.230 00:48, 14 March 2008 (EDT) :::I know but it needs some planning though. --Fox007 15:31, 13 March 2008 (EDT) ::::6 people do as much damage their class allows, monks prot and heal. >.> [[User:Railin|'Railin']] 15:33, 13 March 2008 (EDT) did you forget that there is such a thing as a D/E Obsidian Tank?--71.67.243.230 00:46, 14 March 2008 (EDT) :ill add him when i am done :) --Fox007 12:49, 14 March 2008 (EDT) My hats off to you 2 things this could use a renual nuker and a FoC necro in varients and thak you for auctly makeing a balanced team build :holy trinity = balanced? [[User:Railin|'Railin']] 07:47, 15 March 2008 (EDT) ::Balnced PvE teams smell of "lolololol ur not a part of holy trinity u nubcake lolololol nonubz nonubz" and u like go "Im using Ursan Rage on you!" and then go pwn everything wit heroway and a loyal frend, ye, liek dat it iz. -- [[User:Super Igor|'Igor']] 18:41, 15 March 2008 (EDT) tanks and Guild Wars Guild Wars has no room for a "tank" mechanic. It's a known fact that monsters detect buffs and armor level on targets and go for the least buffed/lowest armor target it can. There's no real way to get around that. More importantly, it's a hint that it's not how you're supposed to try to win. Compare "tanks" in Guild Wars to tanks in games like WoW. WoW has a definite "tank" mechanic; threat. Raid teams manipulate that and give threat-reducing skills to stuff like supporting casters and threat-increasing skills to the tank. There's a definite purpose to it. If you try to go up against a boss and it attacks whoever the hell it wants, your team is pretty much hosed. Sounds similar, right? Isn't that why you bring a tank to UW in the first place, to keep the monsters attacking the right target? Well... yes and no. Firstly, Guild Wars doesn't have a party limit of 40; having a tank or three in WoW doesn't really affect the overall damage the party is capable of. The party spots are much more precious in Guild Wars. Secondly, Guild Wars has a mechanic most games stay away from; maintainable party-wide buffs. Said buffs make Guild Wars a markedly different game than the rest. If you can reduce the damage of Hard Mode Aatxe to roughly 30 per hit with a party-wide buff, why would you spend so much effort on meticulously trying to control aggro via a threat system that barely exists? In the end, tanks are a necessary part of many games. Guild Wars simply isn't one of them. For PvE content, you have stuff like SY, TNTF, DA, Wards, Aegis, spirits, etc. And tanks don't exist in PvP for obvious reasons. -Auron 09:46, 16 March 2008 (EDT) :Well that was good reasoning. But i still keep believing in different ways of dealing with things in Guild Wars. --Fox007 09:52, 16 March 2008 (EDT) ::image:Headbutt.jpg - [[User:Panic|'PANIC!']] [[User Talk:Panic|'pewpewpew!']] 09:54, 16 March 2008 (EDT) ::Can't argue with that. Trying different things is what led to people beating Mallyx for the first time :) -Auron 09:55, 16 March 2008 (EDT) :::While I agree with you on this, I'd just like to point out that there is a simple way to exploit the enemy AI in Guild Wars: 600hp monks. Foes like to attack low armored people, and with 15 AL (or even 5 if the monk kept his starter armor), a 600hp monk can tank efficiently. Other than that, Auron is correct. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō) [snō hwīt tăn] 09:56, 16 March 2008 (EDT) ::::And what if you are the only one aggroing :) --Fox007 09:57, 16 March 2008 (EDT) :::::After being hit by a few pulses of AoE damage, the Aatxe are gonna go "Screw this" and go squishie hunting. - (ză'rē'năs thĕ shăd'ō) [snō hwīt tăn] 10:01, 16 March 2008 (EDT) ::::::Oke this build got failed now but atleast with good reasoing :) --Fox007 10:05, 16 March 2008 (EDT)